Episode Transcript
[00:00:03] Speaker A: Greetings.
[00:00:03] Speaker B: I want to welcome you to a reissued podcast from September 2009, when Unraveling Religion was just under two years old, with Mary Masters, who is at that time reverend of Unity Church. And we speak about an introduction to Unity's philosophy and Christianity. Unity is a transdenominational beyond denomination into a shared framework that honors all traditions.
Unity views Jesus is a way shower, but there are many way showers, including Buddha, Moses, Muhammad. And so I want to welcome you to this very special talk with Reverend Mary Masters of Buffalo's Unity Church.
[00:00:49] Speaker A: Hello, my name is Joel Lessees and I'd like to welcome you to another installment of Unraveling Religion. I'm sitting here with Reverend Mary Masters in the prayer room of the Unity Church. Welcome, Mary.
[00:01:01] Speaker C: Thank you. It's good to be here.
[00:01:03] Speaker A: We were just talking, Mary and I were just talking before the show was recorded about some of the philosophies of Unity. I was wondering if you could give me a description of what Unity is about.
[00:01:14] Speaker C: We like to actually refer to ourselves more as a spiritual movement rather than a religion.
We don't have a lot of dogma and creed, but it's about honoring the divinity within each person.
And as I was explaining to you, one of the things that we believe is that there's one God but many paths to knowing God. And we honor and respect all the different paths to knowing God. And we believe there's good in every spiritual path. And so we seek to find those things we have in common with others for that reason. Also, we don't really use the word denomination very much, but rather sometimes trans, denominational, because it's about transcending, transcending our differences or our boundaries.
In fact, I think the word religion is from a Greek or Latin word, the root of which is actually unity.
That's what religion is supposed to be about, is unity, bringing people together.
So Unity is a movement that was started about 110 years ago. It's an American born religion, I guess, but it was influenced by the Transcendental Movement. Ralph Waldo went Emerson and many people that were just really spiritually awakening at the turn of the century, in the 1880s and 1890s, we were founded actually by a husband and wife couple named Charles and Myrtle Fillmore.
Papa Charlie and Mama Myrtle, but they really experienced. Myrtle especially experienced the spiritual awakening.
And she had been given a diagnosis of tuberculosis and told she had about six months to live and she had three children. And back then when you had tuberculosis, there was not a lot that could be done for you. And so they were really searching for an answer.
And I really like to think that they're not unlike everybody. Any person that walks through the door of our church or any church, that we're all in some way seeking.
Seeking an answer or seeking a better way, or there's some area in our lives, whether it's finances or health or peace of mind or healing in our emotions, where we're seeking a better way or an answer or something to help us live our lives more fully. And so that's what was the case with Myrtle Fillmore. And she went to a lecture one evening and just really got at a deep heart level and gut level and this message that I am a child of God and therefore I do not inherit illness, and it's not God's will for me to be ill or to suffer.
[00:04:02] Speaker A: Seems like a fundamental shift in perceptions about our relationship with God. To have that kind of realization.
[00:04:09] Speaker C: Boy, absolutely.
And to know that the healing power was within her. We believe that the presence of God dwells within each person.
So she really went home and worked with that idea and did a lot of forgiveness work and, you know, a lot of things actually now that many doctors have written about, if you're familiar with the work of Bernie Siegel Chopra, and many of these people that have talked about being able to heal themselves, cancer and various things.
And as a result, within a couple years, she was completely healed of all the symptoms of tuberculosis and began to pray with other people and share her experience. And other people experienced healing in their lives.
And Charles was initially a little skeptical. And he thought, what's going on here? I don't understand this.
But he read and he studied a lot, and he studied, read about all the religions of the world and many of the Eastern religions.
And he said, well, we don't claim any new revelations, but they put together sort of a synthesis of some basic universal spiritual principles that I think are true in many spiritual traditions. Old wine and new bottles, huh? Yeah, that's a wonderful way to think of it.
So that's sort of where we've come from. And then over the years, people wanted more opportunities to study and grow and come together and build communities. And so churches developed, and Charles said that really, for us, unity is. It's an educational movement that we seek to continue. The. The great educational movement that was inaugurated by our master teacher, Jesus Christ.
And, you know, when we use the word education, I really like to.
That there's at least two forms of education, and they both have their place and are important. There's the form of Education that we often experience in schools and traditional settings where it's sort of like open head, insert information, you know, and there's facts and data and there's things you're expected to learn and memorize and be able to repeat back for an exam.
But there's also educate. The word educate or educare comes from a Latin word that has to do with being a midwife giving birth to that wisdom that is already within us, that there's already.
We already have a lot of the answers and that, you know, that the presence of God within us is a great source of wisdom and understanding. And so for us in unity, it's a lot about helping people find their own answers.
[00:06:51] Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
[00:06:52] Speaker C: Helping give birth to the wisdom and the guidance that is within them.
[00:06:57] Speaker A: The kind of intuitive knowledge that.
So you help. Because oftentimes people, I've spoken with people who don't even recognize that they have intuitive knowledge. You know, I think that it's a kind of practice to listen to that deep voice because we do have so many different currents running in our mind that through meditation and through prayer, oftentimes we can find that still placed within that yields that voice, gives that voice, gives rise to that voice.
[00:07:31] Speaker C: Yeah. So that's for that reason. Prayer and meditation is a very important part of our spiritual practice is, you know, that we all believe that each person, you know, that God's an equal opportunity listener and speaker and we can all develop our own, become tuning forks to listen for that intuition.
[00:07:52] Speaker A: Yeah. Wow. You speak in unity about thought and sort of like that, thoughts are way of manifesting or creating our reality.
[00:08:05] Speaker C: Is that accurate? Yeah, boy, absolutely. That's an important part of what we teach is that our thoughts, thoughts are things we say, you know, that our thoughts create our reality.
And one of the ways we refer to unity is that we think of ourselves as a positive, practical, progressive approach to Christianity. And the positive part is, and I really do believe this, that we can't always control what happens to us. Sometimes things happen, or you have a car accident and you don't know why that. But we can always choose how we react to it or how we respond to it.
[00:08:43] Speaker A: Isn't that the truth?
[00:08:45] Speaker C: And one of the practices sometimes I tell people is just try going through one day and whatever happens during the day, say, thank you, God.
Thank you, God. I can't wait to see what good's going to come out of this.
[00:08:58] Speaker A: There was actually a Jewish sage, his name was literally Gamzula Tova, which means this is also for the Good. So everything that would happen to him, he would say, gamzula tova.
[00:09:11] Speaker C: Yeah, that's wonderful. Because I do believe that's true, that we get what we're looking for in life. And when we look at things and we're expecting something negative to happen, or we look at a person or a situation and we think they're against us or that this isn't, you know, this is working against me, boy, we just create an even greater resistance to our good coming to our lives. Whereas if we can look at. If I can say that everybody here really wants me to succeed, you know, or that I know this is working, all things are working together for my highest good, definitely. And, you know, then, boy, your experience of life is so different.
[00:09:49] Speaker A: Yeah, it flips it inside out. It could flip it inside out for some people. But even in that wanting, I think, as I understand it, it's the wanting good for everybody that really helps us to see that everybody has our best interests at heart. The wanting of everybody's best outcomes and circumstances. Right.
[00:10:10] Speaker C: Yeah. Well, and that's another thing that I really believe, that in unity, we talk a lot about prosperity and that there's not a limitation, you know, that my good is not, you know, that my good doesn't have to come at the expense of someone else's good. That there is enough in the world that, you know, that we really do want what is for the highest good of all concerned, you know, and we don't have to fear that, well, if I get something, then there's not enough, but that there is enough.
And that one of the ways that God works in our lives is through divine ideas, through inspiration.
That it's not like sometimes the things we're praying for are going to just drop out of the sky one day and I want a new car, and I'll go out into my driveway one morning and it'll just be materialized. Maybe Ed Big man will show up and say, you want us, you know, but that God works. One of the ways that we co create with God is that we get divine ideas, inspiration, and then it's ours to follow through on those divine ideas and say, gee, maybe this is my next step. And this is my next step.
[00:11:23] Speaker A: That is very true. And I think oftentimes maybe we could speak a little bit about how Jesus taught through parables. Right. Because the kingdom of God is generally.
It's here now, as I understand it, but it's also.
There's a physicality to it, and then there's a spiritual dimension that is sort of beyond words.
And I think that that's why Jesus oftentimes spoke in parables, because he was expressing the wordless through constructs, so that people could relate and like a ladder sort of climb to experience the same thing that he had experienced. Because I believe that every person is capable of the same kinds of experiences that Jesus had.
[00:12:10] Speaker C: Yeah, well, that's.
Yes, you've covered a lot there. But that is very much what we believe as well, is that we see him, Jesus, as our master, teacher and way shower, that our focus, very much in unity is about his life and teaching and his message.
And we really believe in taking him literally. When he said this, you shall do an even greater thing that he awakened probably as much or more as anyone that's ever lived. The Christ's presence within him. He reached a level of conscious awareness of his divinity.
And there have been other great masters who have done that too, and Buddha and Lao Tzu and Muhammad and others.
But Jesus was saying, follow me, that this is the way.
And parables were a powerful way of teaching for lots of reasons. People will remember a story, I think, more than they'll remember. Here's five points. You know, go do these things and your life will be better, you know.
You know, in my Sunday sermons, you know, I always try to find a powerful story to share to illustrate the point, because then people walk away and they'll probably remember the story and will wait more than they will, you know, seven quick, easy steps to heal your life.
But also in those stories were embedded layers and levels of meaning. You know, there was a surface level, and then, you know, and because, you know that, you know, certain levels of the stories, not everybody was ready to hear or to understand in consciousness.
And often the stories would. Parables would have a twist or an unexpected ending, or he would put together two ideas that most people would be probably walked away scratching their head, thinking, what's he talking? What does that mean?
You know, a mustard seed and a mountain. Tell that mountain to move if you have this much faith. The mountain, how could that be? You know, But I always understood that he was sort of creating the space for us to grow into that level of consciousness where we would understand a deeper meaning.
[00:14:18] Speaker A: Definitely. I always understood that parable to mean there's a saying by the Zen master Dogen. He says the mountains are constantly at rest and constantly walking.
And I think that he was expressing, through a different vantage point, the same thing that Jesus was expressing, that we walk with the mountains, that we move with the mountains, you know, in the current of time.
[00:14:45] Speaker C: Mm, that's beautiful.
[00:14:47] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:14:47] Speaker C: Yeah.
But, yeah, you know, and often with these stories, we're meant to take them and contemplate them and to think about, you know, what does that mean? And what does that mean for me? And you know, that it's, you know, you can hear something one day and it has a meaning for you one day, and a few days later you're in a different reach, in a different place in consciousness, or there's something else going on in your life and you can hear that same story and get a new insight about it or a different meaning. And, you know, I think that's part of the beauty of the Bible is there are stories that go back thousands of years, but every time you pick it up, there can be a new meaning to it for, you know, you can say, oh, see something in it that you didn't see before.
[00:15:33] Speaker A: It's interesting that in my favorite book, which is the Snow Leopard by Peter Matheson. I don't know if you're familiar with that.
[00:15:41] Speaker C: No, I'm not familiar with that.
[00:15:42] Speaker A: It's a wonderful book about his journeys through Nepal and Tibet.
But in it he says he quotes someone or he writes this himself, I can't remember which. But it's just that this moment is the scripture of Zen, you know, that this moment is the scripture period. You could end it that way. And that there's an aliveness here that in the ordinary passing moments that if you are aware of, become quite amazing.
[00:16:17] Speaker C: That's really great. Yeah.
[00:16:22] Speaker A: But so I was curious, Mary, if you could tell me a little bit about.
We were talking just before the show began about this new position that you've been.
[00:16:38] Speaker C: Oh, I've been on the. Our church as a member of the Network of Religious Communities. And for some of our listeners that may not know what that is, it's an interfaith network of religious organizations and churches and synagogues and temples and mosques in the western New York area.
And anyway, I was just recently elected co president of the Network of Religious Communities.
[00:17:05] Speaker A: Congratulations.
[00:17:06] Speaker C: And it's a wonderful. I feel so good about it and it's such a fit for us as unity in what we believe. But you know, there are Hindus and Baha' Is and Sikhs and those that practice the Jewish faith and Muslims and Christians that, you know, we meet about probably seven times a year. And you know, just when we sit down at a table, I just feel like it just is so powerful to me to have sitting around a table at the same time, Muslims and Jews and Christians and, you know, Buddhists and, you know, that can all sit down peaceably and share, you know, our common values of care for each other and our world and wanting to seek peace and do things in our local community that help, you know, care for people who are less fortunate. And it's just a great thing.
[00:17:55] Speaker A: So to me, that's one of the strongest elements of Christianity is the service to the poor.
[00:18:03] Speaker C: Yeah. And I just thought, boy, if.
If outside our little community here in Buffalo, if things were like this in other parts of the world, we wouldn't have the.
Anyway, so it's good that we can come together locally and pray. That kind of cooperation and coming together can be something that could occur all around the world.
[00:18:30] Speaker A: You demonstrate on the micro level that it's possible on the macro level.
[00:18:35] Speaker C: So some of the things that the network does, we have staff and they're located in the building actually it's kind of across the street from us on Delaware Avenue. And they do quite a few educational programs where people can learn about different faith traditions and learn those things that we have in common to appreciate our differences.
I was telling you about a recent thing. In the last year or two, we were invited to assist with some of the training for the residents in the UB Medical School to share with them about the different approaches to end of life care issues for people of different religious faiths.
So when doctors are trained and they're in the hospital or in hospice, that they can be respectful and appreciative of people of different religious backgrounds. And.
And we have a food pantry and do a lot of outreach to help people who need food.
Helping people.
People can apply for food stamps through the network and various things. And we'll be having an event in May called the annual Appreciation Dinner. That's a really big thing. We have about six or seven hundred people come to the Hearthstone Manor and various congregations of all different faiths.
It's an opportunity to honor a volunteer in your community or two or three. Some groups honor several volunteers in their either church or temple or mosque, and they have a speaker and a program and it's just a wonderful celebration.
[00:20:06] Speaker A: Do you have any specific little exchanges or anything that sticks out in your mind that may have been meaningful to you?
[00:20:17] Speaker C: Well, we had a thing happen in our meeting last month in January.
There was a resolution that had been written up. I think probably maybe it was by an interfaith group from another city concerning the conflict in Gaza.
And that was brought to our network board to see if we would endorse that. And make a public statement about it.
And the two people that presented that to our board to ask that we vote to endorse it, which we did. We're a Muslim and a rabbi. And just to see, you know, a rabbi and a Muslim standing there together asking that we support something that would call for peace in the Middle East, I thought was quite significant.
And that happens all the time with the knower.
But, you know, it's just a model of cooperation and working together. And, you know, there's another thing that's kind of interesting. There's. There's a fellow that's on our board. He's a Muslim, and he's a professor, I think, at the UB Medical School, and he trains the res. Part of his responsibilities are training residents at Sisters Hospital. And I think this is a really neat thing, that he makes it a requirement for everyone who goes through his residency program as a physician that they have to come over to the network food pantry and volunteer for two weeks to work in the food pantry and get to know the people who come day in and day out in need of emergency food supplies. And I think it just creates in those residents and those people who are about to become physicians a sensitivity and awareness to the concerns of human beings they might not have encountered, you know, might not normally encounter. So anyway, just a. It's a small thing, but it's a big thing. I think it creates a big, you know, there's a lot of anyway, physicians who.
I think that's good for them for two weeks in the food pantry.
[00:22:22] Speaker A: Definitely. Definitely.
Also, Unity is. We've spoken a little bit about the metaphysical aspects of the teachings of Jesus and how Unity embraces that.
What are some of your other favorite scriptures that relate to the teachings of Jesus?
[00:22:48] Speaker C: Well, obviously, we use the Bible as a text, but I guess I'm like you too. I really like a lot of Buddhist. A lot of the Buddhist philosophy and approach to life. And, you know, I guess the more I've read other authors that have written about Buddhism, Pima Chodran and Thich Nhat Hanh, some of the more popular teachers recently. And one of my favorite books is A Path is a Path with a Heart by Jack Kornfield. He's really great. He's Buddhist meditation teacher.
So those are things that have really spiritually fed me. And I've enjoyed reading a lot.
And I love the Tao Te Ching. You know, there's many translations of it. But I did a series of Sunday lessons a couple years ago on world religions, and for eight weeks, I Talked about the various religions. And I haven't really read the Bhagavad Gita or anything, but I've done a lot of chanting. But I did a whole lesson on the Tao Te Ching and that was wonderful.
[00:23:57] Speaker A: Any kernel or nugget that you would take away from that book and offer to people.
[00:24:04] Speaker C: You know, I can't, I don't know that I can think of anything right now. But you know, it's a series of very short sayings.
You know, the other thing that I really love is the Gospel of Thomas.
And I've been reading a lot of. There are a whole series of gospels that are non canonical gospels that didn't make it in the Bible.
Some people are aware of this and some people aren't. But I've read a lot about the history of early Christianity.
And in the first couple hundred years after Jesus died and was resurrected, there were a lot of gospels, there were a lot of writings that were circulated. And there were many different groups who had many different ideas about who Jesus was and what was the nature of God and humanity and was he divine or human or both, and how do we find salvation?
And there wasn't just one idea about it.
And there were many gospels, there were many writings and letters that were widely circulated.
And you know, it was when the Council of Nicaea came together in the year 300, and I forget it was 325 or 300 and something, they selected what would be the canon, what would be the books that would be officially canonized in the New Testament.
And then a directive went out in the Roman Empire that all these other writings were to be destroyed and eliminated. And it sort of silenced the voice of these many other groups. And in the last century there have been.
It's interesting how some of these things have been surfaced through archaeological expeditions or through accidental discoveries by shepherds in the Middle East. But you know, some of them in big pottery jars, they have discovered manuscripts of these gospels.
And it's given us a real glimpse into the history of early Christianity and how many different voices there were.
But one of the ones that's gained a lot of popularity is called the Gospel of Thomas.
And it's a series of sayings and there are many very reputed, very well respected academic biblical scholars that think that there's quite a bit of authority, authenticity to the Gospel of Thomas.
And there are no stories in there, no parables or anything. It's just a list of like 117 statements. And he said this, and he said this, and he said this.
But there are many scholars that really think that many of the things in the Gospel of Thomas may be more authentic than the sayings that we have of Jesus in the, in the New Testament.
But one of the statements in there that has meant the most to me is in the Gospel of Thomas, and this is just paraphrasing and I can't remember, but it was something, the fact that if you give birth to that which is within you, it will save you.
And if you don't give birth to that which is within you, it will kill you or you will die.
And the idea is that we all have a voice, a gift, or in unity. We have a lot of people who are in the creative arts, and I know how important it is for them to give birth or give voice or to express their art or their music or their creativity, or if you have a gift for writing.
And that there is this creative urge within us.
When we give birth to that, when we find a way to express it and share it with the world, it brings us greater aliveness, you know, and when we suppress that, when there's something in us that's really wanting to get out, that we want to, but we deny it or go, I'm not good enough, or no one would want to hear what I have to say, you know, then we kind of die a little bit every day, you know, it deadens us.
And so that's one of the messages from the Gospel of Thomas, how important it is to give birth to that voice within us.
Whether the gift is being a radio interviewer, but that we all have something inside us that's wanting to be expressed in the world.
[00:28:34] Speaker A: Yeah, that's, that's something because I know many people who do have creative or artistic leanings struggle with that, because there's a conventional wisdom that says there's a system and a society that we have to constructively be a part of. And oftentimes it's the, the calling of an artist to see past that or see through that or see beyond that. And sometimes artists don't feel as though they fit into the system the way that other people appear to.
[00:29:06] Speaker C: Well, and unity tends to attract a lot of creative people.
You may have noticed all the paintings in our sanctuary we actually have. Our sanctuary is an art gallery. And every two months we have a different exhibit, but we feature different artists. Whether it's photography or painting or, or sculpture. And we have some poetry reading groups and just people that love to that. We really support and nurture those who want to share their creative talents.
So we always have a new art show, and then we have an opening reception to honor the artists.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: And what about music? Is there ever any music here?
[00:29:47] Speaker C: Well, yeah, we have a music program and a music director. And so obviously we have music during our Sunday services. And we have a small choir that's growing.
And actually, this Sunday, February 15th, we're celebrating African American History Month, and we're going to have some African dancers and drummers and poetry reading. And for the last two years, the program has just been outstanding. It's just been really, really great.
So we will have a group of African dancers and drummers and poetry and then a special talk. But it's just. I mean, it's like at the end of the service, people just. It's just usually a standing ovation. Everyone stands up and can't help. You know, people don't usually applaud during a Sunday service, but people are usually so moved that they can't help themselves.
[00:30:41] Speaker A: So you've given a little bit of the. The history of Unity, and we've talked a little bit about the teachings and talked a little bit about what's offered here at Unity. Is there anything else that comes to mind, Mary, that you'd like to share?
[00:30:57] Speaker C: Well, just that we are open and welcoming to all people. We're a very diverse congregation of ages and races and just people from all walks of life. And we. We really welcome everybody. And I think one of the things that people often say newcomers, when they walk away after being here the first time, is they say, wow, that's really a friendly church. I can't believe how friendly people were.
[00:31:23] Speaker A: Seems like it should be built into the notion of what Christianity is all about.
[00:31:28] Speaker C: But I'm just. It's really been notable how many people have, like, just like, wow, you know, so it must be something that people find to be really exceptional with our church.
[00:31:43] Speaker A: Yeah, well, because I know I came for the healing ceremony for the Buddhists, the Tibetan.
[00:31:52] Speaker C: The Tibetan monks.
[00:31:53] Speaker A: Yeah. And that was quite an amazing experience. And I was wondering. I know we've covered this on Think Twist Radio and I was here for it, but are they going to come back again? And do you have other things like that?
[00:32:07] Speaker C: Well, it's funny you should mention that, because actually, I think that we might. I need to give them a call. And that was when we hosted them last summer. That was the third time we've hosted them in about the last six years.
And, yeah, actually, I need to call and see if we could schedule them again. We usually try to get them on Their way down to Lilydale. I think they're scheduled to do a presentation at Lilydale and create a San Mandala. And they, they literally travel, you know, around the country in a bus. And, and so we'll try to see if we can schedule them again for June.
And we do some other things that are open to the, you know, that draw, you know, we really like. I like to think that our churches is a community center as well as just a church. We serve a much broader community of people than just the people that come on Sunday. We do a lot of spiritual movies that attract people and we had one last month that featured Wayne Dyer on Ambition to Meaning.
[00:33:08] Speaker A: Oh, that's brand new. Well, I don't know how brand new it is.
[00:33:12] Speaker C: Yeah, well, when we showed it on January 12th or something, they allowed a two week period when it was sort of the premiere. And I believe now you can order the movie through their website.
But before you could order it, we were, I think, the only location in the Buffalo area that had a premiere showing of it.
[00:33:30] Speaker A: How was that?
[00:33:31] Speaker C: Oh, it was great, actually. It was really good. I like Wayne Dyer.
[00:33:34] Speaker A: I like him too.
[00:33:35] Speaker C: And you know, he, he also, I guess like Unity or like many of us, integrates wisdom from a lot of different spiritual traditions. And so he was sort of one minute he'd be quoting from the Tao Te Ching or talking about something else or the Course in Miracles or that he shared wisdom.
And the message of this movie was about how often people in their midlife begin to reflect more on wanting to find a sense of purpose and meaning in their lives. That for many people, not always, but for many people, the first part of our lives in our 40s and 50s were sort of driven by ambition or achievement or wanting to more material goals and desires. But that for many people around the time of their midlife, they really begin to search for deeper meaning in life and how can I make a contribution and, and, and what that's about for people. And so it was a very good movie.
And so we don't have anything scheduled right now coming up, but often we've shown quite. We showed the Secret before it was available for people to purchase. We've shown the Indigo movie about Indigo Children.
[00:34:54] Speaker A: What is that?
[00:34:55] Speaker C: Well, it's a. There are some. Several books out on it. And, and the idea, the theory of it is that there's sort of a whole kind of generation of young people that are being born now who are kind of, I don't know whether the right way, we would say more advanced in consciousness or more psychically or spiritually open and intuitive and that they have trouble sometimes fitting into the square boxes that schools and you know, that, you know, in a lot of traditional schools it's everybody's got to fit into a cookie cutter mold.
And that there are a lot of children now that are much more spiritually aware, much more intuitive and awakened who need more of a supportive environment to be in to let them know and
[00:35:49] Speaker A: reflect what is going on with you is okay and normal and natural.
The snow leopard talks about that too. That it's a quote from the first page of the book is a quote from Rilke and it talks about how visions and death and the so called spirit world are so daily parried out of our life that the senses to which we can grasp them are atrophied. You know, that these normal things for us, which some people classify as extra sensory or paranormal.
[00:36:28] Speaker C: Yeah, I think there is fortunately getting to be a lot greater acceptance that there are people that have, whether it's paranormal experiences or psychic or spiritual or profound spiritual experiences or communication with people on the other side.
And you know, 50 or 100 years ago people like that would have, were deemed crazy and they'd be locked up in a mental institution or you know, they'd be, you know, and now there's a greater understanding that there's a lot more going on that you know, or just the intuitive callings that we have within us to. To want to do something creatively or different or out of the box that we need to create more space where that's okay for people to think out of the box, to live out of
[00:37:22] Speaker A: the box, to express ourselves fully as human beings and the spirit souls that we are. You know, it seems very vital and goes back to that. The book of Thomas that you were talking about.
[00:37:35] Speaker C: Yeah, the Gospel of Thomas. Thomas, yeah.
But if we bring forth that which is within us, he will give us life.
[00:37:43] Speaker A: Yeah, wonderful. I'm also wondering, Mary, if you could talk a little bit about 911 happened a long time ago.
But many people perceive a real division between the world of Christianity, Judeo, Christian society, an Islamic or Muslim society. The worlds were for a while and still do seem to clash or collide. I'm wondering if you could offer some kind of thoughts about what you see as the resolution to this or some words of healing or whatever you think you might.
[00:38:22] Speaker C: Well, I'll always remember it was probably a few weeks after 911 or maybe a month or something and it was the COVID of Newsweek or Time magazine. I can't Remember which now, but the COVID article was why do they Hate Us?
And I thought that was such a profound question. And it's like, why do they hate us?
What is it that it's not just like, oh, you know, we in the United States are pure and innocent, but what is it that, you know, what is it that they're perceiving in us that has caused such fear and such hostility and such anger? And what is it that we have done to contribute to that?
And, you know, I really love that. I heard President Barack Obama say a few weeks ago that he was saying that, that the directive he was giving to some of his foreign. Some of the envoys that were being appointed in the secretary in the State Department to go and meet with foreign leaders around the world is he was telling them to begin by listening.
That so often, you know, our American foreign policy has been about dictating rather than listening. And he was telling Richard Holbrooke and different ones that were being. Being sent out as diplomats begin by listening. And I thought, wow, it just gives me shivers a little bit. But I think that's what we need to do is begin by listening and trying to understand what is it that has contributed to all of this.
There's an approach to communication that we teach in unity called non violent communication, where compassionate communication is. It was developed by a man named Marshall Rosenberg, who was a psychologist. And this is kind of a four step process to communicating in difficult times when there's great conflict.
And he has developed this approach and he's taken it all over the world. And he has mediated with tribes in Africa and Ireland and Northern Ireland, between Protestants and Catholics in the Middle east and with gangs on inner city streets in the US and in families and people who are going through divorce.
And I really believe that there are tools and there are methods and processes that can help us learn to communicate with each other better so that we can begin to take some steps forward in healing
[00:41:03] Speaker A: true human beings. Yeah.
Wow.
[00:41:07] Speaker C: So that's my sense of what's needed is a lot more listening.
[00:41:12] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:41:13] Speaker C: I mean, on all sides.
[00:41:15] Speaker A: Yeah.
Inwardly, outwardly.
[00:41:18] Speaker C: Yeah, inwardly and outwardly.
[00:41:20] Speaker A: Yeah. Wow.
[00:41:23] Speaker C: And having some good tools. So that too, you know that listening is not like when you're listening. Sometimes when we listen and we hear something that's hard to hear, our defenses go up right away. And it's like sometimes they say some of these people aren't really listening. They're just. While the other person is talking, they're immediately formulating what their response is going to be or their counter attack.
But it's really deep, heartfelt listening.
[00:41:48] Speaker A: Deepest self is silence in one sense. So listening to that, then that seems like a good beginning.
I want to thank you for talking with me today, Mary.
[00:42:01] Speaker C: Well, thank you. I've really enjoyed it.
[00:42:03] Speaker A: I've really enjoyed it, too.
[00:42:05] Speaker C: You know, I just thought maybe before we close, if I could give a couple websites, please, for our Unity Church. If people would like to know more about our Unity Church, they can go to unitybuffalo.org and if people would like to know more about the network of religious communities, they can go to www.reglicnet.org.
and there's a lot of good information there.
[00:42:29] Speaker A: Would you mind saying a little closing prayer? Would that be okay?
[00:42:34] Speaker C: Sure. Yeah. There's a prayer, actually, that we say every Sunday at the close of our service, and maybe we can say that.
Say that now. It's called the Prayer for Protection.
The light of God surrounds us.
The love of God enfolds us.
The power of God protects us.
The presence of God watches over us.
Wherever we are, God is, and all is well.
And so it is. Amen.
[00:43:06] Speaker A: Amen. Thank you, Mary.
[00:43:08] Speaker C: You're welcome. Thank you.
[00:43:09] Speaker A: Okay.
